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Climate Change, if we don't sort out Deforestation, we can Forget Changing the Lightbulbs

Last week, Jay Tea over at wizbang classic had a post titled Common-Sense Environmentalism.

The shorthand being that we should make some common-sense adaptations to our life, as the world's largest consumers, so long as it doesn't harm our pocketbooks or our lifestyle. Jay took a few obligatory swipes at the environmental 'whackos', at the same time, acknowledging the strength of the movement. And nearly all of his commenters had sensible environmental suggestions. That seems like a quite a gain from the last two to three years....from the more usual reaction of mocking environmentalists, 'Al Gore doesn't live in a cave, so he's a hypocrite'.

The so-called 'wacko enviromnentalists' have definitely moved the spectrum of the debate, even if they are ridiculed by conservatives.

I recall just 8 months ago, in response to the question, 'Do you think mankind is the primary cause of global warming?

Of the 59 Right-of-Center Blogs who answered.... 0 (0%) said Yes..... 59 (100%) said No...What do they think it is 'sunspots', and we are called the 'moonbats'?

And the White House... Its position is ever so slowly changing, well, I was going to say, at a glacial speed, but giving the rapidly increasing receding rate of glaciers and the crucial attendant snow pack, 'glacial speed' would no longer be the operative term, and given the administration continuing resistance...They are still dragging their feet, censoring reports, watering down language, fighting over any commitment even to the long term problem they now admit exists, but really don't want to engage ($), unlike the war on terrorism in which the Bush/Cheney gang ''deficits don't matter', are ready to open the vault.

The knowledgeable Steve Clemons, in an excellent informed post, says that the American game-day strategy for the upcoming 'climate change' conference in Bali will be Hard vs Soft obstruction...This will be the legacy of the Bush administration for the future generations to decide, what public interest the Bush 43 gang were defending- hint, actually they are defending the private interests of Big Oil with public taxpayer's money.

Where I have been living in the past decade, the center of Brazil, is one of the neglected, but crucial areas in the global struggle, to combat carbon emissions. The Amazon basin, which has been experiencing more and more drought, provides 20% of the planet's precipation, and most of the Amazon's fresh water comes from the snow pack that is rapidly diminishing in the Andes. In addition, the rainforests, which absorb CO2, are being cut down for monoculture, soya and precious hardwoods, the latter which are sold illegally in Asia and America.

But, yesterday was one good day it what seems like a losing struggle. The British Labour government announced it was going to financially preserve the rainforest in Guyana, the fourth largest in the world.

As the shadow Environment Secretary, Peter Ainsworth, a Tory said "If we don't sort out deforestation, we can forget changing the lightbulbs. Deforestation is the neglected piece of the jigsaw. There must be a way into this and Guyana are offering what could be a model for how to do it."

It is a pity that Peter Ainsworth couldn't be a model for his counterpart American Republicans.. on not 'obstructing' international environmental initiatives.

Note: Wizbang Blue is now closed and our authors have moved on. Paul Hooson can now be found at Wizbang Pop!. Please come see him there!

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Comments (8)

Lee Ward:

You do that, Jay, and be sure to include the part where conservative jackasses like yourself are no longer denying the problem exists -- now you're just consumed instead with figuring out how to blame Bill Clinton.

The staff of Wizbang failed to accurately report on global warming for years, with that major-league jackass Paul leading the band of morons in their March of Denial. The Wizbang staff has so HUGELY failed on this story that having you stop by and lend us your considered opinion on the subject is nothing more than a fat-assed joke.

Glad to hear that you're concerned about the problem now. Scratching your head is much more productive than just continuing to scratch the other end, you putz.


Oh so much meat here, it is like like turducken stuffed inside an emu, inside caja china pig!

First off, I don't ridicule Gore for not living in a cave, I ridicule him for living in a house that uses more energy than 20 normally-sized houses, and having two more homes on top of that! Mocking conservatives for not living according to conservative values is part and parcel of the Liberal philosophy. So, goose meet gander...

Second of all, the Amazon basin is a lousy carbon sink. The soil is poor and things there while green now, don't grow all that much. More carbon dioxide is "sunk" into the central Atlantic Ocean in the form of calcium carbonate than into all the "rain forests" world wide. Rain forest soil, world wide, is missing most nutrients as they have been leached out by the rain and persistent growth. FYI, grasslands are much bigger carbon sinks as they are regrowing annually. (Now the Amazon is a tremendously diverse area in both plant and animal species, and it is worth preserving for that reason, among others. But not as a carbon sink.)

Finally, I don't think Bill Clinton, per se, is at fault. The real problem is a group of anti-capitalist types who figured out sometime in the 90's that couching their usual Neo-Marxist and Maoist rhetoric in environmental terms made them seem less like fruitcakes to the public at large. I joined Greenpeace and the Sierra Club in the early 80's when they had real goals, I left both when their national agendas became less about those goals and more about DNC talking points.

Steve Crickmore:

MunDane, well, that is good news on the Amazon, because that is in a sense what it is expected to become or could become, a savannah in the next 30 or 40 years. As you imply with its soil, the Amazon is very hard to reforest or be good for anything except what nature intended it for; the world's premier rainforest of enormous bilogical diversity.

It is pity that from your experience you believed that Greenpeace and the Sierra Club were becoming talking shops 'for DNC talking points', but it is better than the alternative, 'RNC talking points' or political hacks like this lady.

Civil behavior:

One necessary read for all climate crisis activists.

Under a Green Sky by Peter Ward.

Read it today.

Lee Ward:

Good news for conservative wingnuts everywhere - Wizbang's Cassy Fiano has picked up the flag dropped by Wizbang Paul and is now leading the parade of right wing idiots denying the existence of global warming.

In her post published today titled "Another global warming tragedy" Cassy denies the problem exists right off the top, caiming that the "tragedy" isn't the fact that we're facing a global crisis -- no, no....:

If by tragedy, you mean yet another example of how global warming is all a giant scam...

It's a scam?

Cassy is selling our planet down the river by denying there is a problem President Bush should have been dealing with for the last 7 years -- a problem every other nation in the world has acknowledge and is addressing -- and she does so all for the sake of a better chance at a GOP White House next November.

You gotta love the right wing blogosphere and their disconnect with reality.

Steve Crickmore:

I think Cassy is too young to remember the cold winters in the north -east in the 50 and 60's. If the evidence needed are anecdotal stories the right blogosphere loves rather than science, I used to be able to skate across the Lower St Lawrence River which was normally fozen in the middle of winter for a month or two, between the Canadian and American border and never see an immigration official. I don't think it has frozen over for many years (though I could be wrong).

I don't understand why the right wing blogosphere is a so resistant to the idea that our atmosphere should not be used simply as a waste disposal site any more than the oceans should. Actions by billions of human beings have enormous consequences. I believe Cathy lives in Florida, which will probably be one of the worst affected areas to global warming in the near-future. I wonder if in 10 years from now she will still by writing about global warming as a scam. I think not


First off, I would like to point out that I have never used a pejorative term in referring to any poster of an opposing viewpoint, and would like the same courtesy extended to me.

That having been said, there needs to be some perspective here: I have never advocated using the atmosphere as a dump, just as the Global Warming advocates have never advocated nuclear energy as an alternative to coal/oil/NG power generation.

The problem with most future projections is that they are off by an order of magnitude at least, especially when compared to past projection to the present. For example, the National Hurricane Center has been hyping the 'danger' GW poses to North American hurricane frequency and power. For the last two years, NOAA and the NHC have drastically over-predicted the number of storms, the strength of the storms and the number that make landfall. Why? Computer models are flawed in both amount of data they can interpret and number data sources they use. Projections can not be reliably made with the system as it exists.

Yet they do, and are given instant credence because it is Teh Guv talking. (Funny how large groups of people inimicable to the idea of government telling us certain news claiming it flawed at the source, readily accept other news coming from the same source.)

Steve Crickmore:

No, MunDane..I wasn't thinking of you when I talked about the 'wasteful' ways we are using the atmosphere, just the right blogosphere in general. I realize hurricanes are not as numerous and sharp in the last two years, (the effect of another el Nino?) and I could stand corrected, but Antartica has been cooler than expected last winter, as well, unlike the Arctic certainly. I think it was you on the previous global warming post who said roughly a one degree weighted differnce, actually you said (.7) doesn't seem like a whole lot, but some places will be up 3 degrees, others down 2, but I think in the last 6 years, 5 years have been the warmest on record for the globe as a whole. I'm going on memory...If it was post rather than a comment a few days after, I would look up the exact figures...The Bali conference is coming up, starting tomorrow til Decembeer 14 so we will be able to continue the debate. We'll have at least one post, from this site.


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Publisher: Kevin Aylward

Editors: Lee Ward, Larkin, Paul S Hooson, and Steve Crickmore

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